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htxt: lowdrive: Thanks for posting the interview with Noah Clarke. Good read.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 4:18:15 PM
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kingfan_98: note: a buddy of mine lost a 125k business deal during the last protest. he was literally stuck in traffic, couldn't get to the meeting, and the potential clients flew back to europe.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 4:03:03 PM
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Scribe: OK...just checking. These days, you never know around here.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 4:02:19 PM
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kingfan_98: scribe: because they blocked the street. they cost literally hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of dollars worth of damage via loss of business and productivity. fuck them, and azking is right, they should have been run over. your stupid gripe does not give you the right to harm me, no matter how noble you think your cause is...
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 4:01:15 PM
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Scribe: But hey...let's not go further down this road. I shouldn't have said anything to begin with.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 3:54:52 PM
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Scribe: As one who has been a part of many similar protests, I find that offensive, azking.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 3:54:22 PM
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azking: Those people will accomplish will get on tv which is their goal anyway. They are probably professional protesters. That actually is a career.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 3:53:32 PM
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azking: Just run them over.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 3:52:33 PM
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Scribe: KF: are they "piece of shit dirtbags" because they are protestors, because they blocked the street, or because you don't agree with them? Just wondering.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 3:47:31 PM
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lowdrive: Hmmm what if we tried Cap Space at D?
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 3:16:27 PM
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naturallawyer: kc: agree on both counts. I'm certainly not excited about next season. DL is crazy if he doesn't get at least one veteran defenseman. A top-6 forward should also be a priority. I'll be moderately surprised if DL does anything before training camp.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 3:04:44 PM
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lowdrive: k98 - could be worse, the middle guy might have just gone for coffee and got chained to the other 9 dirt bags!
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 2:49:07 PM
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kingscast: azking: Don't you get the sense that Lombardi is just going to hoard these prospects we have? I really believe, as he said to Helene, that he thinks "we're in good shape". I heartily disagree.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 2:47:14 PM
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kingfan_98: it could be worse. you could be stuck in traffic for the last five hours thanks to ten piece of shit dirt-bags who chained themselves together in the middle of an intersection downtown. good times, good times.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 2:45:14 PM
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azking: 3 months with a swiss cheese defense and shaky goaltending could have us what, 10 games out. Lombardi has work to do when he decides to come back from vacation.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 2:34:11 PM
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kingscast: It's fun to watch the rookie/kid defensemen in camp and at the pre-season games. You think to yourself "that's a pure Manchester line". Well, that's what the opening night lineup on defense is actually going to look like.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 1:50:21 PM
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kingscast: Yep, it's official. The Kings are reporting that Greene will be out 3 months. We have more holes on defense than swiss cheese at this point. I dare say a defenseman should be a priority over a top-6 forward.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 1:43:00 PM
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azking: I was working on New Years Day. On my cellphone driving back from a huge party in San Diego and hungover but in that 2 hour drive, I closed a deal that made me over $3,000 just for taking the call. I could have easily been on vacation that day but you never know.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 1:06:55 PM
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azking: Vbing, do you think the business of hockey just goes on hiatus because of vacations? Hardly. Deals seem to be getting done. Look at TSN signings and deals. It is ridiculous to think that just because GM's go on vacation that agents and players will just sit idle and wait for them to come back. Come on man, you know big business never takes a day of, ever. Top Realtors work on Christmas for Christ's sake because Jewish people don't celebrate. My buddy's car dealerships are open on Christmas Day and it is one of the biggest vacation days of the year. It's also their biggest day of the year.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 1:05:30 PM
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naturallawyer: I'd rather DL acquire one second-pairing defenseman (JJ's new partner) than two third-pairing defensemen. They'll have to be jumbled a bit to cover for Greene's absence at the beginning, but it would be better for the season as a whole.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 1:01:10 PM
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kingsforlife: I guess there's always an excuse for inactivity from the believers.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 12:58:40 PM
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kingsforlife: vbing: Look at all these RFA deal getting done. Look at Fro and Pony getting signed. People's phones are working and work is being done. And like esaki said, these high-salary people have their Blackberries with them EVERYWHERE. To think otherwise is kidding yourself.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 12:57:46 PM
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lowdrive: I guess the question is whether any of the 3rd pairing defenseman are better than giving Hickey/Voynov/Drewiske the spot.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 12:55:07 PM
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lowdrive: Interesting interview with Noah Clarke from The Mayor.
mayor119.blogspot.com
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 12:52:48 PM
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vbing: No matter how what you think of managers, hockey is still a seasonal business. As it is, I doubt that he is not doing any work, but there is plenty of other things to do other than talking to other GMs and agents about signings and he has those responsibilities as well. The thing is that in these cases, you need to be able to get both parties to the table, you can't just force them through because of your own, your organizations, or your fans impatience.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 12:51:46 PM
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vbing: kfl, who exactly is DL supposed to be talking to if everyone else is on vacation?
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 12:48:22 PM
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ericd: esaki - bergeron *is* good and is ufa after this year. Not cheap but maybe in a package with boston turd?... Dunno' my thought is predicated on his being re-signed by LA and that is dangerous territory given DL so...
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 12:37:52 PM
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ericd: but the start of camp is what? 5 weeks away? I would want all my guys in camp...
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 12:31:24 PM
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ericd: hello jay mckee...
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 12:28:54 PM
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esaki: Anyway, FWIW, I don't think it has anything to do with vacation or anything. I think finding a couple of third-pairing defensemen on the cheap isn't exactly the world's hardest task, and Lombardi's being patient and seeing if anything materializes. The start of the season is a long way away.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 12:26:30 PM
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Scribe: Dustin Brown told me that he was expecting the same turnout or better than last year for the summer workouts...FWIW.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 12:15:37 PM
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esaki: Actually, the idea that somebody who makes the kind of salary that Lombardi makes being able to just take a total work-free vacation, regardless of whether that person is a doctor, lawyer, businessperson, or general manager of a hockey team, is sort of funny.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 11:48:08 AM
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kingsforlife: * them
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 11:39:05 AM
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kingsforlife: I like that one actually. Next time I have a trial coming up I'm going to tell my boss "Sorry. All my friends at other firms got their trials done already and are taking vacation to Cancun so I'm going to take one too and go with one. Good luck with that trial."
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 11:34:19 AM
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kingsforlife: If DL is "on vacation" instead of addressing glaring needs then his job security should be dropping. Other GMs, in large part, have earned a vacation by filling holes and making their moves in the first few weeks of free agency. DL has not achieved that goal yet. So to say he should get a pass because he's taking a vacation instead of doing his job is a bit silly.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 11:22:55 AM
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kingsforlife: If that's the case with Greene, does it make it that much worse that DL hasn't picked up a d-man yet?
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 11:21:28 AM
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naturallawyer: The Kings don't have the kind of defensive depth in the system to cover three holes. As it is, Drewiske and/or Harrold will be playing nightly shifts (better than Jones IMO), and then another rookie or two. DL has to get a veteran defenseman before the season starts.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 11:21:20 AM
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vbing: Pure speculation, but I have to think that Frolov (like many other FAs) were waiting for Kovalchuk's deal to be done so that they could gauge market values. I am not sure that any forwards were going to do any negotiations until his salary was slotted. With the amount that ended up being negotiated with NJ, many FAs had to downgrade their expectations, and are signing very short term deals in hopes of a better market next season. Again, I think that the cap penalties being imposed have really changed this years FA market.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 11:15:38 AM
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vbing: azking, I am not sure what you expect for DL to do right now. It's not only him that is on vacation - this is the time of year when almost everyone is on vacation. That is why there is little to no news because all of the sports writers schedule their time off for when all of the GMs are off as well. You just sitting here complaining about a lack of action makes no sense when there have to be two parties to make any deal happen.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 11:11:49 AM
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vbing: Apparently Mitchell is not even talking contracts until he can clear medical evals.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 11:09:56 AM
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kingscast: azking: I don't think the issue is depth because we have in on defense. But you want your depth filling in a slot here and there as people go down. The problem is we'll be relying solely on depth outside of three players.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 10:49:49 AM
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kingscast: lowdrive: Yeah, Rich mentioned that a couple of weeks ago. Turnout was going to be about the same.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 10:48:50 AM
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lowdrive: I had heard there were summer workouts with the Kings players going on like last year. Anyone hear anything about that?
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 10:39:53 AM
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azking: Willie Mitchell can easily replace Greene.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 10:33:08 AM
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azking: But all is well. Just ask Dean.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 10:16:06 AM
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azking: And there is where having no depth and a paralyzed GM who doesn't plan for things to happen.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 10:15:31 AM
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kingscast: If that's true, Deano is going to have to go dumpster diving again. Our defense is thin as it is.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 9:57:29 AM
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kingsforlife: Carcillo is too much of a liability.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 9:32:14 AM
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kingsforlife: If true, that's awful news about Greene. Why wasn't the surgery done months ago when the Kings were eliminated?
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 9:31:59 AM
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pucknfuss: I like carcillo as a good team player ala lappy, but he is not a heavyweight. If westgarth has a bad right hand, do we need to shop another heavyweight?
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 9:29:42 AM
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kingscast: Matt Barry says Matt Greene will be out 3-4 months following shoulder surgery. Westgarth too won't be ready as he had hand surgery. FUCK.
www.hockeybuzz.com
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 9:14:53 AM
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kingsforlife: Bergeron goes UFA next year and I'm not sure Boston can re-sign him. They already have Savard locked up long-term. They also have Krejci. And now they have Seguin, who may have to play wing. They'll be hard-pressed to find the cap space to sign him.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 9:09:13 AM
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vbing: Fwiw, Poni is a better skater than Fro, so he in theory would help in the transition game.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 8:13:09 AM
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esaki: Smyttie, I'm not sure you need your forwards to have a ton of foot speed to play the way Nashville or Philly play, because those teams aren't all that fast up front...I may be describing it wrong as a "transition game"...ultimately, the breakouts are going to come from the defensemen being able to make an exit pass from the defensive zone to spring mismatches (whether it be odd-man rushes, or a couple extra seconds to set up a cycle), or otherwise skate the puck into the zone (which takes pressure off of the center)...the offense won't look much different from last year, it should just be more effective if Johnson can improve his passing and hockey sense, and we can add somebody who can move the puck to the third pairing, whether it be Hickey, somebody via trade, or whomever.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 4:33:08 AM
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esaki: I don't think Boston would move Bergeron without getting somebody like Jack Johnson in return. Bergeron's good, he would be one of the best #2 centers in the Western Conference (I don't think he can play wing), but he would be tough to trade for.
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 4:21:45 AM
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ericd: Somewhat of an idle dream, but... thinking of Boston, do you see any chance of swinging a deal for *both* Ryder and Bergeron? both are UFA after this season so not a sure thing for Boston to resign. Appreaciate they would really not want to give up on Bergeron but perhaps a package could be worked out... I know he's a center but you wonder if he could play on a wing?... still make a good 2nd line center... just a thought...
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 2:05:30 AM
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ericd: Vbing - who knows if he has a norris clause in his contract - neither here nor there really, cause we have the cap space to cover it... good on him if he does. What could that be worth? 250k? 500k?
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 1:51:27 AM
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vbing: Also, who believes that Doughty may have gotten big bank this year? I mean, a Norris nomination is one of those throwaway bonuses you give on a rookie contract because who really thinks he'll get a nomination?
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 12:46:20 AM
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vbing: not much discussion on this topic, but the reason that this year's summer, IMO, is because almost 1/3rd of the league is going to have to penalties for being over the cap once performance bonuses were factored in. That brings up the question ... are performance bonuses rolled back along with salaries when revenues are calculated? ... And if not, were most of this year's UFas looking for bonus contract?
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 12:43:46 AM
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vbing: s2, I know you don't bother to read my posts, but I posted earlier thatbPoni's contract is a little high ...
Thursday Jul 29, 2010 - 12:36:14 AM
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Scribe: Cliff: you've been the voice of reason lately. Wonder when lightning is going to strike the RT twice. :-)
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 10:53:31 PM
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naturallawyer: If Poni does well enough to get the $200K bonus, we won't care about his salary because he will have performed well (I would think that the bonus thresholds are somewhat lofty). If not, then he gets paid $3M, virtually the same as Frolov, who also underperformed.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 10:14:12 PM
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kingsforlife: Not really. They are both too much for a 3rd line winger.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 9:12:52 PM
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Scribe: Is there that much of a difference between $3.2 million and $2.9 million?
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 9:02:12 PM
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schroeder2: vbing: I didn't ask what we paid Frolov. I know what we paid Frolov. And by the way, his cap hit was $2.9M, which is lower than Poni's will be (I realize he cashed more than that this year). I simply stated that $3.2M is a bit high for a 3rd line winger. Do you agree or disagree?
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 8:42:52 PM
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lowdrive: Forgot how good smyth is at creating traffic in front of the net. Also, handzus is everywhere in this game.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 8:12:04 PM
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Smyttie: The Kings played their best hockey with the cycle game; if Lombardi can't get the players to support Kopitar, then he better get players that excel on the cycle.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 8:04:50 PM
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Smyttie: Esaki mentioned the Kings generating offense via transition being a key next season. I don't think the Kings have the speed for that to be a real option; without finishers, they will run a real risk of getting into run and gun situations, which will not work out in their favor.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 8:02:30 PM
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lowdrive: NHL network showing game 3 kings v nucks
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 7:56:54 PM
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kingsforlife: Just because it was done before doesn't mean it's proper asset allocation.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 7:56:48 PM
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Grinder: THN.com Blog: Examining the Frolov and Ponikarovsky signings
www.thehockeynews.com
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 7:32:48 PM
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lowdrive: Vbing: that nesn link I posted below is about Ryder. Former 30 goal scorer coming off a crappy season. Just dl's type
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 7:18:49 PM
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vbing: S2, it's less than we paid Fro to play that position for the last couple of years ...
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 7:09:07 PM
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schroeder2: kf98: So are you saying $3.2M is a good contract price for a 3rd-line winger?
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 6:39:08 PM
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vbing: Kings already have way too many passers. They need finishers.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 6:05:02 PM
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kingsforlife: Weird. I never saw Frolov turn into a shooter when paired with ANY playmaking center throughout his tenure in LA.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 6:01:18 PM
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kings#7: Top tier passers turn shit into 20 and 30 goal scorers. You play on a line with a top passer, you become a shooter
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 5:46:26 PM
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vbing: Savard is a passer not a shooter. The Kings need a shooter.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 5:30:10 PM
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nortrek: I'm kinda sorta glad the Kings did not give Kovy that big dough anyway...he's no Gretz...he is not THAT big of a marquee player- wondering who you would pick to skate with Kopi- that is a big job!
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 4:46:35 PM
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kingfan_98: and for anyone interested, tonight it's the mls all-stars vs some craptastic team from manchestah, england:
www.justin.tv
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 4:46:26 PM
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nortrek: Frolov is gone- we won't miss his consistency- and I had heard Dino did not like him, and Kovulchuk did not get "good vibrations" from Dino, nonetheless.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 4:44:39 PM
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kingfan_98: htxt: personally, i hope afro doesn't realize his full potential in ny, because then we'll all have to hear about every. single. point. all. season. long.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 4:42:44 PM
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nortrek: Captain Canada and Williams did not show much prowess in the playoffs. The Kings have got to do better on their psych game too. What a disapointment.
Which defenseman would you like to see here, guys- on the free agent list, I mean. Yeah, O'Donnel left, but there MUST be someone to take his place- wondering if any of the Manchester team is ready for graduation...
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 4:41:55 PM
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kingfan_98: i'm pretty sure eric meant "psychic," although psychotic probably fits just as well. ;-)
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 4:41:11 PM
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nortrek: I would like to see Stepniak come to Los Angeles and leave Wobble Williams on waivers.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 4:39:31 PM
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nortrek: Kool-Aid Kool-Aid, tastes great; wish we had some- can't wait!
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 4:38:51 PM
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ericd: true vbing but what about savard? Nice talent... But big contract...
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 4:32:36 PM
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ericd: az - you and i are psychotic man! Beforei checkeed the board iwent out and got some take out sushi for lunch... That wasabi is wicked... My nose is clear as... Just need a few hours for that ginger to ferment some more... Then the cat aint gonna know what hit 'em...
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 4:30:17 PM
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vbing: Word is that Boston may have to move Ryder because of cap issues. DL might consider trying to resurrect his career here. Contract year, so he may put up some goals.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 4:23:36 PM
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vbing: The contract is a bit high for Poni, but he will slot in better as a third-liner than Fro did. Fro was frustrating because he was an in-betweener. Definitely more talented, but only showed up about 30% of the time. Actually, bringing in Poni may help the PP a bit, because he is more of a banger and crasher than Fro, and that't the way the Kings play on the PP.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 4:22:36 PM
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htxt: The problem with Frolov is he plays a style of game that didn't really mesh with anybody except Handzus. And that might only be due to the fact that Handzus can play with virtually anybody. I personally hope he goes on to fulfill his potential in NY, but I wouldn't bet on it. I think others here are correct - he'll end up being the same talented, inconsistent guy he was here.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 4:03:56 PM
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azking: Man, the shits I get after sushi are epic.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 3:53:07 PM
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Scribe: KF: not bad. :-)
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 3:51:02 PM
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kingfan_98: scribe: don't confuse people with facts. the fact that everyone here was complaining afro should really be a third line winger, and that nyr signed him for the same exact price we signed our new 3rd line winger, is not comparable. because really, if you play him on the first line, that magically means he's not really a 3rd liner, the fact that someone has been arguing so notwithstanding...
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 3:46:10 PM
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esaki: The statute can't be collective bargained away?
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 3:44:49 PM
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kingscast: You think Terry Murray didn't like Frolov? Wait until Tortorella gets his hands on him.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 3:39:16 PM
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naturallawyer: chiboy: additionally, having looked at the statute, it doesn't mean a 7-year-plus contract is unlawful, just that a player can invoke the statute to get out of such a contract (if the statute even applied to the NHL, and I don't think it does). That player would be asking for all kinds of trouble, as would any other team attempting to sign that player.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 3:21:56 PM
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naturallawyer: chiboy: without looking into it carefully, I've heard this issue mentioned before and I believe Hammond stated that the NHL CBA isn't governed by that statute. It's not uncommon that the ordinary employment rules get changed by CBAs.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 3:11:13 PM
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azking: Now that's what I'm talkin' about Lowdrive!! Bueno!!
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 3:08:16 PM
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chiboyla: Questions for the lawyers round the table: has anyone ever thought about whether an NHL team in California would be barred from signing one of these exceptionally long UFA contracts by the "Seven Year Rule" of Labor Code sec. 2855? In other words, could the Kings have even into the contract that Lombardi supposedly offered to Kovalchuk? I'll hang up now and listen to your responses.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 3:05:31 PM
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schroeder2: Sound like a pig party!
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 2:59:00 PM
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lowdrive: azking: Well to be fair, its like giving the fat chick to your cousin who is in from out of town while you smash away on her hot friend and your best friend smashes away on the other hot friend..you know, 3rd line..ok yeah I couldn't think of how to apply your analogy.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 2:51:13 PM
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azking: What is interesting is that nobody wanted Poni at all. The Pittsburgh people say he is dogshit, Toronto people were doing cartwheels when they dumped him. The guy was just sitting there collecting dust much like Torres is who will probably be our next signing. I guess if we sign 2 20 goal dolts we get 40 goals. Hard to get really pumped up when you sign a guy that nobody wants. It's like fucking the fat girl of the group just because she is there while your buddies are smashing away on her two hot friends.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 2:45:58 PM
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Scribe: I think Cliff said it best.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 2:45:10 PM
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Scribe: KFL: In other words, it wasn't a panic move. :-)
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 2:42:04 PM
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kingsforlife: The fresh start should definitely be good for Frolov. He and Gaborik will probably come out of the gate strong. It's too bad NY really doesn't have a quality 1C to play with them. They'll get stuck with Prospal or Dubinsky probably.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 2:42:02 PM
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naturallawyer: Frolov will be better in NY than he was here, so however good he is there is no indication that he would've produced the same here. He's probably a second-team player, a guy who needed the wakeup call before he really understood what it takes.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 2:37:32 PM
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naturallawyer: The Poni signing was fine. A panic move is usually a high-risk stupid move. The Poni contract is very low-risk and rational given the team's needs and future projections. Nothing to complain about there unless you miss Frolov.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 2:36:13 PM
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kingsforlife: Frolov will be a first-liner in NY.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 2:35:48 PM
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kingsforlife: Scribe: Perception isn't always reality but for a lot of people, perception is reality so people will view it as a panic move, regardless of whether or not it is truly a panic move.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 2:35:27 PM
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Scribe: But let's face it...Frolov might get off to a good start with the change of scenery, but he'll end up being the same player he was here.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 2:35:05 PM
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Scribe: Not necessarily...but he would be here.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 2:34:31 PM
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schroeder2: Scribe: You think Fro will be a 3rd-liner in the Big Apple?
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 2:31:12 PM
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Scribe: schroeder: That's basically what Frolov got from NYR.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 2:24:46 PM
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Scribe: That is, short of signing Kovalchuk.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 2:24:29 PM
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schroeder2: And $3.2M for a 3rd line winger seems kind of steep...
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 2:24:21 PM
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Scribe: If you're going to use that logic, everything the Kings do this summer will be a panic move. That's ridiculous.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 2:24:13 PM
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Scribe: Sure he could have. But that still doesn't make it a panic move, really.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 2:23:33 PM
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schroeder2: One thing that concerns me about Poni is that he put up those rather modest goal numbers playing more quality minutes in Toronto than he will get in LA. He won't be on the #1 PP, which I assume he was for good portions of his time in Toronto. And the "but he could be great playing with Kopitar" argument doesn't fly. Not based on the fact that the dude didn't do diddly (no, not Bo Didley) while playing with Malkin or Crosby (well, to be more accurate, he did earn himself a few healthy scratches in the playoffs)!
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 2:23:09 PM
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htxt: One year is low-risk. If he fits well, they can extend him. If not, then hopefully somebody on the farm like Clifford will be ready to step up by next season.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 2:16:18 PM
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kingsforlife: It seems like a panic move because it comes on the heels of not being able to get the bigger target. If he wanted to fill the 3LW spot all along then he could have done it 3 weeks ago.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 2:15:33 PM
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Scribe: It probably is a one-year rental. Don't see why it's a panic move, though. He needed a third-line winger to fill Frolov's spot. Given who was available, why not sign the guy? It's not like he is being signed to fill the number one winger hole.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 2:14:36 PM
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azking: I think by Lombardi only signing Poni to a 1 year deal it shows that he really doesn't care for the guy because if he did, he would have tried to lock him up longer because he is only 30. It is a panic move that is done just to fill a gaping hole. It's like a one-year rental.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 2:10:25 PM
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azking: I like Ryder. He is a bit of an interesting guy but a RW. You mix in his 4 seasons and 2 shit seasons and you have a guy who averages 24 goals. Poni over 6 full seasons averages 18 goals. Ryder is the better player.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 2:08:53 PM
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lowdrive: Hmm an underachieving former 30 goal scorer. Just DLs kind of guy!
www.nesn.com
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 2:02:07 PM
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azking: What sucks is I hate the fact that the two owners of OC's teams have personally laughed at me since I like the Dodgers and the Kings. What can I say? My buddy likes OC's teams as well and he just says I need to realign but no way in Hell. He was the first to call me when the Kings got booted out of the playoffs saying it is a long way to the Cup. He actually had the Cup at his restaurant.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 2:02:00 PM
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azking: I hate the Angels by the way and Moreno knows it. He is great friends with my buddy who owns the Catch. He always rubs shit in my face since I like the Dodgers.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 1:59:01 PM
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kingsforlife: The Cubs are the New York Rangers. Overpaid and underachieving.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 1:58:47 PM
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kingsforlife: I'm not too worried about Fowler, yet. In recent years, plenty of guys who have fallen in the draft and were thought to be "bargain picks" have been busts. More often than not, they fell for a reason. Every other GM passed on these guys for a reason.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 1:57:17 PM
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lowdrive: azking: Let me just take a step back to something you said before. This team was a complete mess when DL took over. It's in much better shape now. I don't recall a time in Kings history where they had this much home grown talent playing together, so I don't think its fair to say "this team always.." does anything when it comes to 'taking the next step.' This approach for the Kings is new. We don't know what they're going to do to keep the young players, but so far they have resisted trading any of them and have said they're going to re-sign them long term. So I'd say its a bit early to equate them to baseball teams who have repeated the same pattern of acting as minor league teams for the yankees and red sox for decades.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 1:56:30 PM
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azking: I'm sorry man, I am getting all pissed off and it is messing with my mind. I mean they giftwrapped them their first title. I remember they won the series as a Wildcard
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 1:56:24 PM
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kingsforlife: azking: I think the Twins are an excellent example of where the Kings are, and could be going. Same goes for the A's.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 1:55:45 PM
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notko1: so what the hell has Moreno won? McCourt and him can compare division championship rings
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 1:54:36 PM
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Scribe: Sure KFL...blame the phone. :P
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 1:54:32 PM
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azking: Maybes, If's, Shit Happens, Who Know's, It Could Happen, That Sucks, We Almost Had Him, We Didn't Want Him Anyway, We Were So Close..... are common things said by fans of teams that never lift a trophy.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 1:53:54 PM
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kingsforlife: Scribe: That's the goal for today. ;)
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 1:53:53 PM
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notko1: thats funny cuz the Angels won the world series before Guererro and Moreno
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 1:53:45 PM
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kingsforlife: Whoa. Sorry about all the repeat posts. My phone was tripping out.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 1:53:12 PM
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azking: If you would rather go big and fail then you are going to love this team because that is all they do.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 1:52:21 PM
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azking: You are correct with the Angels and they won nothing until they got Guererro and Moreno took over. They outbid the Dodgers for him and it has eternally burned Dodger fans. Frank McCourt blocked the deal at the 11th hour after it was done. You just proved my point. I have met Moreno several times and he has echoed my point that you don't win shit until you spend money. Moreno personally told me that the Dodgers and McCourt giftwrapped the World Series to him.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 1:51:42 PM
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notko1:
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 1:51:33 PM
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lowdrive: azking: again. proven NHLer, not proven awesomesauce NHLer.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 1:49:42 PM
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notko1: Yeah, I think the Kings are committed to winning a cup. Have they made a significant move this summer? No, sometimes you have to wait and see what happens. Maybe tomorrow Rick Nash decides he doesn't want to live in Ohio anymore. Shit happens, I would rather go big like (Kovy) and fail then run out and get a piece that doesn't fit. Sometimes you have to wait for the big fish to come along again
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 1:49:38 PM
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azking: Notko1, you can't argue baseball with me. I know it better than anyone who has ever set foot on this board. The Twins, Royals and Pirates have something we don't so your right, I can't compare. They have a Championship.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 1:48:30 PM
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notko1: the 2002 Angels did not spend money. They have only started spending money since Moreno bought the team
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 1:47:23 PM
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azking: Notko1, do you really think the Kings are committed to winning a Cup? What exactly have they done to support their comments that they will do what it takes and they will be aggressive this Summer? You are becoming Vbing in that you have to find an extreme example(Cubs) to show that spending can be a flop. Sure but it won a WS for Boston, NY, Angels, etc. Teams that spend money win, period. Go look in any major sport. Cheap teams, never, ever win.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 1:46:34 PM
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notko1: I'm not gonna get in a pissing match but comparing the Kings to the Pirates ( a team that has gone almost 20 years without a winning season) and the Royals ( a team that hasn't been to the playoffs since their World Series team in 1985) I know plenty about baseball
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 1:44:55 PM
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azking: Lowdrive a 20 goal guy in the NHL is essentially Parse. When all you do is play offense, you should be able to score 20 goals. Big deal. Noted 20-goal juggernauts in the NHL: Eric Fehr, Brian Rolston, Devin Setoguchi, Steve Ott. Real Hall Of Famers there.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 1:43:41 PM
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notko1: BTW, what the hell numbers are you looking at when you say the Royals sell out? Maybe in 1985
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 1:42:54 PM
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notko1: I mean the Cubs are active in free agency. You want Soriano? Maybe Fukudome? They spend money, why aren't they good?
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 1:42:11 PM
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notko1: azking, I don't disagree that the Royals don't make money. They have made poor decisions drafting wise and free agency in baseball doesn't necessary fill holes wisely. see Andruw Jones, Jascon Schmidt and pretty much any free agent in Dodgers history other than Kirk Gibson
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 1:40:59 PM
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azking: Notko1, you don't know enough about baseball then. The Royals have been run over the coals because they continue to sellout but refuse to spend the money. There is also a huge revenue share in baseball and those teams have been accused of pocketing the money and not spending the profits. Go do some research.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 1:38:03 PM
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lowdrive: azking: I disagree about Pon..Pony..Poni? whatever. That guy. He's very much a proven NHL forward. He's just not a proven star NHL forward. He's a 20 goal 35-40 assist guy. He's done it for four years in a row.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 1:33:27 PM
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naturallawyer: notko: hope you're right.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 1:23:23 PM
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notko1: It doesn't matter NL, all these defenseman can be grouped into the same category. Fowler won't be a #1, all these guys will be #2 to #4 guys if they pan out. The upside just isn't there, we aren't talking about the Doughty, Bogosian, Schenn, Pieterangelo draft here
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 1:21:53 PM
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naturallawyer: I really hate that the ducks drafted (and signed today) Cam Fowler. What a bunch of stupid luck. The stupid belongs to the NYR of course.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 1:18:25 PM
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notko1: azking, stop comparing hockey and baseball together. There is no cap, could you really expect the Twins to have three 100 million dollar dollar players in Mauer, Morneau and Santana. They had to make choices, comparing the Kings to the Pirates and Royals is just stupid. The Pirates have pissed away draft picks for the last 15 years and the same with the Royals. Hockey has a cap, the first core guy which was Kopitar that came up for free agency they signed to a longterm deal. You can't compare Kovalchuk to Doughty
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 1:17:49 PM
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kingscast: azking: I would probably complain less if there was a legitimate scoring threat (above 6'0") in the Kings system. But there isn't. I'm all for letting kids develop but we don't have a Duchene, Stamkos, etc prospect in the system. And, yet, Lombardi neglects to address the issue year-in year-out. I look at the defense next year and, yeah, we need a guy. But we also have a ton of high-end talent in the system. If Lombardi wants to wait it out and address the issue in training camp, that's fine. But he needs to get a forward on the team with high-end talent and a few years (or more) left on his contract. This is where he fails miserably.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 1:12:26 PM
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azking: This type of stuff really isn't any different than what the Dodgers are trying to shove down their fans throats right now or what you see with teams like the Kansas City Royals, Oakland A's or Pittsburgh Pirates. They are always getting to a point then gutting their teams and starting over. That could easily be the Kings because the one thing these programs have in common is that they are only willing to play 75% of the game which is Draft, Develop and then they struggle to build from their and eventually whent their players are too good, they want more money. Look at the Minnesota Twins as an example. Torii Hunter and Johan Santana are both playing for the Angels and the Mets because they outgrew their team's budget. What if Doughty asks to be paid more than any other Defenseman in hockey? He could theoretically do that, especially if he wins a Norris. Will the Kings actually pay him or try to negotiate him down to the point where he goes Kovalchuk and says adios.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 1:06:54 PM
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azking: But as the skeptic can say, will the Kings even spend the money to retain their core once they come up as well? Just because Dean says that is a goal, we have now seen that he tends to say whatever he needs to say to justify inactivity. My thoughts are that this team will constantly be lose one, get one, lose one and they never will really be loaded UNLESS all of their prospects pan out which is expecting miracles. Nobody is trying to hold Lombardi to some unrealistic standard. I just don't think it is too much to ask for him to upgrade the product with more "Proven" NHL talent and Poni is not an example of a proven NHL player. If anything, he has proven to be unreliable and inconsitent. I think the skeptics message is misrepresented here. I can speak form myself in that I think both AEG and Lombardi tend to bullshit and outright lie a lot. I think we are being sold a bill of goods that is not accurate. I feel that the Kings are not going to spend that money they have at all. I think they knew that Kovalchuk wasn't going to take their deal and are passing that off as being active and they also probably underbid on the other FA's as well because they are only interested in getting players if they take less money than market. It just comes off feeling like a big charade to me. It's easy to always say you are in on someone or make what you feel is a "Competitive" offer but if the Kings version of a competitive offer is shit then it is isn't an accurate statement of really trying. I can say I walked by and had a shot at this hot chick just because I said Hi and she said Hi back but I was never in the game at all. Nobody is this unlucky with deals unless they are A.)Completely inept and clueless for which they should be removed from their position or B.)Blowing a bunch of smoke to hide the fact that ownership is not committed to spending the money it takes to really go for it. That is my point at the moment.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 12:59:32 PM
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ericd: esaki - yes dl is a bullshit artist and yes he shoots his mouth off but i still expected him to make a strong play for a good defenseman and not be frozen in place by kovy blindness. Overpay if he must but the d was the need. Your two questons will resolve the rest... This year anyway
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 12:49:22 PM
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Scribe: schroeder: No, but KFL is seeing six of everything for awhile. :-)
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 12:36:58 PM
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htxt: Part of Lombardi's problem is that the big club ended up being better sooner than he (but maybe not the fans) expected, before the kids marinating in the AHL have had a realistic chance of stepping in. So he's still signing roster filler like Poni because kids like Clifford are still making their way through the system. He's probably going to have to sign/trade for a #4 Dman because the D pipeline (Hickey/Voinov/Martinez/Muzzin) might still be one year away.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 12:33:17 PM
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schroeder2: Does that make six sources?;-)
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 12:06:17 PM
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Grinder: Chiboy: I expect Clifford to fiLl one of the vacant forward slots
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 12:05:39 PM
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Scribe: KFL: I see you already hit the booze you mentioned on FB a little while ago. :-)
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 11:50:18 AM
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kingsforlife: Most of the Hickey hate was coming from one source FWIW.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 11:49:04 AM
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kingsforlife: Most of the Hickey hate was coming from one source FWIW.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 11:49:02 AM
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kingsforlife: Most of the Hickey hate was coming from one source FWIW.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 11:49:01 AM
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kingsforlife: Most of the Hickey hate was coming from one source FWIW.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 11:49:00 AM
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kingsforlife: Most of the Hickey hate was coming from one source FWIW.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 11:48:59 AM
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kingsforlife: Most of the Hickey hate was coming from one source FWIW.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 11:48:58 AM
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schroeder2: Legit top 3 forwards on this team? Kopitar. Legit 2nd line forwards on this team? Smyth and Brown. That leaves #1 LW, #1 RW and #2 C.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 11:43:09 AM
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kingfan_98: htxt: could be, i've just seen an awful lot of hickey hate on the board. just struck me as odd when i read some slack being cut to jfj...
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 11:28:31 AM
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htxt: kf_98: I think if you drew a Venn diagram you'd see a large overlap between people who are being patient with both JJ and Hickey.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 11:14:02 AM
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chiboyla: JMFJ seemed to have started to "figure it out" the last third of this past season, IMHO. If he can continue to play like that, and continue to reduce his mistakes, I think we'll all be quite happy.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 11:03:18 AM
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chiboyla: BTW, the Kings only have five forwards under contract past this coming season, and I think that Schenn and Simmonds are the only sure bets to get contracts past that, so DL better get his ass in gear filling his "boxes".
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 11:02:02 AM
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kingfan_98: i honestly don't know the answer, that's why i'm asking, but are the guys here willing to give jfj a little more time to figure things out - since dmen take longer to develop and all - the same guys already writing off hickey?
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 11:00:58 AM
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chiboyla: Of course, the good news is this: Kopitar is 22; Doughty is 20; Brown is 25; Quick is 24; Simmonds and Bernier are 21; Schenn and Forbort are just 18; Hickey, Voinov, Teubert, Moller and Loktionov all are still young, and the odds are good that at least some of them will develop into decent NHL players. But Dean has GOT to acquire some more pieces to build around those guys, because the "core" is not enough to get it done.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 10:59:02 AM
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kingfan_98: esaki hits it dead on w/r/t the message being given out. i don't think our team is in such bad shape as many suggest, it's just that dl must like the taste of leather, because he keeps putting his foot in his mouth. it's all about controlling the message, and he can't (or doesn't care to) do that. it's like the old 80's joke, about propaganda. the us and the ussr get in a two man race, and the us wins by a mile. so the ussr goes back and tells their citizens, the mighty ussr came in 2nd place, and the us came in next to last. dl cannot spin or propagandize; he is either completely incapable of forming a coherant, logical, positive message, or else doesn't care to. and whichever case, he winds up looking stoopid.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 10:54:29 AM
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kingsforlife: JJ is still young and shouldn't be graded on the Doughty curve. Most d-men mature a bit later (see Duncan Keith). JJ came straight from college to the pros without the benefit of AHL seasoning, etc ... He will be fine over time. He just needs to learn consistency. He's able to bring a top-notch game when it counts (playoffs, international play). He just needs to be able to do that consistently in the regular season as well.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 10:52:17 AM
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chiboyla: Dean Lombardi is not terrible. But he is pretty average, IMHO. He has whiffed on every significant free agent he has pursued, and most of the guys he actually landed were OK (at best) to terrible. He has drafted decently, but then again, he has had a TON of draft picks, many of them high in the draft. Only two of his picks have made any impact whatsoever in the NHL so far. He has made some decent trades, such as Smyth for Quincey and Preissing and Williams for O'Sullivan. The Bottom line, for me, is that he just hasn't done ENOUGH. He's had a ton of cap space, but has yet to use it wisely. He's got a ton of young prospects and draft picks, but hasn't moved any of them for an impact veteran. Those deals DO get done in the NHL, but Dean just hasn't gotten any done. If anything, he is too conservative.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 10:51:32 AM
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htxt: I'm not worried about Johnson eventually getting it - he's only played 2.5 seasons due to injury. I just don't know if it happens next year. It's reasonable to think he'll be better, but I don't know if we can expect a big jump because as azking pointed out it's the mental part of the game with him.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 10:49:05 AM
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kingfan_98: pnf: dl gets a non-passing grade for the summer, if not for the (lack of) activity, then for the stupid comments made to any number of reporters. smyttie gets a non-passing grade because he only shows up when there's something negative to comment on.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 10:48:02 AM
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kingsforlife: kc: The whole concept of puck-mover v. shutdown guy is a little overblown in my estimation. I'm not saying we need another JJ-type to pair with JJ. The guy just has to be able to make a good first pass out of the shown. He doesn't have to be the JJ-type and be able to lug it up the nice himself. He can be the shutdown type but still be able to make that one pass to have the forwards off and running.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 10:46:25 AM
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azking: I don't see that happening next year. I think goaltending will be adequate at best and Johnson will still be hit and miss. I think Johnson may be that way his entire career because it is mental with him. He plays when he feels like it and makes a lot of rookie mistakes that he should never make. Sydor was like that as a King and it took him years to finally become a complete guy.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 10:45:59 AM
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chiboyla: Actually, I think a 3rd question could be added to that list which is (3) Will the Kings stay reasonably healthy this year? The Kings were seventh in goalscoring last year, which probably is good enough to make them a contender. If Smyth and Williams can play more games (a *huge* "if") that number will go up. If Kopitar, Doughty or Brown go down, that will be a big problem, because there is not a lot of depth (IMHO).
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 10:44:36 AM
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lowdrive: Did I miss something? When did we get Gleason? Or are you waxing philosophically?
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 10:41:41 AM
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esaki: Actually, what Simmonds, Williams, Zeus, Doughty, whomever do...whether they improve, stay the same, fall apart...who knows...it's totally irrelevant. There are two things that matter next year. (1) Will the Kings finally get good goaltending from someone? (2) Has Jack Johnson figured things out? If the answer to both questions is yes, then the Kings can play like the Flyers, Predators, and to a lesser extent, the Canucks. Keep the shots against down, generate all even-strength offense in transition (which they can do if they have Doughty and Johnson on separate lines), and win the special teams battle (ditto). Assuming no catastrophic events, and no major changes, those are the only two questions that matter.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 10:32:16 AM
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kingscast: kfl: Do we need a puck mover with JJ? He moves the puck just fine. I'd like to see a puck mover and a shutdown guy on each line.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 10:31:31 AM
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kingsforlife: kc: I'd welcome that move with open arms. Although, I'm not sure Gleason is that great of a puck-mover.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 10:27:21 AM
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kingscast: Hearing chatter on Twitter that Grebeskov has signed in the KHL. Not a terrible defenseman. The market is incredibly thin for what we need. Personally I'd love to see Gleason paired with JJ and one of Hickey or Voynov play with Greene.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 10:24:11 AM
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naturallawyer: kfl: I agree. The two-way veteran defenseman is probably the team's biggest need at this point, at least in the short term. Long-term, the first line has bigger holes.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 10:22:24 AM
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kingscast: azking: Perfect. Thanks for the info.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 10:20:15 AM
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naturallawyer: I tend to think that the increased experience in the young guys will be offset by the added age to the older guys, but keep in mind that players can improve in all three zones. Maybe Kopi doesn't score more, but he improves his skating or puck control, and that keeps the other team from getting the puck a little more during the game. That kind of stuff can have an impact in the long term (and especially in the playoffs where the margin for error is thinner). Still, this season is mostly about the Kings' future goaltending. All we can do is sit back and watch it play out. Bernier deserves high expectations but no prospect is a sure thing.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 10:19:32 AM
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kingsforlife: DL isn't going to improve the top six IMO. I just don't see him ponying up the necessary assets. He could really help himself by getting a good, puck-moving, quick first pass 3/4 d-man to play with JJ.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 10:17:47 AM
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azking: My point is that even if we wash out Frolov's dogshit point season with Poni, we have to find more firepower in our Top 6. Either that or go get Kaberle and figure all our scoring is going to come from the back with Doughty, Kaberle, Johnson and Hickey.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 10:07:35 AM
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azking: How can we just assume Kopitar is going to improve on a 34 goal/81 point season with the guys he has on his line? I don't see it. Brown isn't going to score more than 25 goals, maybe 30 on a miracle season. Doughty had 16 goals and 59 points. The top Defensman in scoring in hockey was Mike Green with 19 goals and 76 points and that is with Washington's high octane firepower. Doughty isn't going to blow that away. Maybe he gets a few more goals and gets to 65 points but let's be real. Simmonds has the most room here. Stoll and Handzus could easily be worse due to age. Williams is worthless.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 10:05:55 AM
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azking: Can't be more than $2K-$3K Escrow costs. Average on a home is $6K-$8K.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 9:58:57 AM
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kingsforlife: nl: Those people just point to the "core" guys and assume Kopitar, Doughty, Brown, JJ, Simmer, Richie, and Quick will all be better. It's a decent assumption but not a sure thing. They also fail to account for the fact that our veteran players will be a year older and have that much more wear on their bodies. That means Zeus, Willie, Smyth and Stoll will all be in worse shape. That's concerning, especially considering how people have touted Smyth as the reason this team turned the corner last year.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 9:55:28 AM
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naturallawyer: People whose vacant holes must be filled: Randy Jones, O'Donnell, Modin, Halpern, and Ivanans. Which one of those losses is going to kill the Kings? There is an aggregate problem there, but one that hopefully can be overcome rather easily without gutting the team (some AHL guys, a minor trade or two, or waiver-wire pickups which DL seems to love). No reason to assume anything this year.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 9:51:14 AM
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naturallawyer: I don't think even the most optimistic Kings fan "assumes" we will be better. Maybe, maybe not. But the point they are making is you can't assume the team will be worse, either, and I think that's a valid argument.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 9:46:20 AM
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kingscast: Any real estate experts out there? I'm selling a parking spot that I bought as an investment in my building. Curious what escrow costs would be on something around $35k? Any info would be appreciated.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 9:46:00 AM
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azking: Our second line is going to have Stoll, Simmonds and Parse. Our first line is Smyth, Kopitar and Brown. Is that even remotely scary to a team with a good defense?
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 9:37:20 AM
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azking: This team still isn't that great. How can anyone look at our Top 6 and think it is even comparable to the top teams out there. Assuming we will get better goaltending doesn't work with me. We have a rookie in Bernier and a guy who I think is hit-and-miss in Quick. We could just as easily have worse goaltending if Bernier needs seasoning and Quick shows that he was more of a fluke. I can't fly with that one until I see some consistency out of Quick and/or Bernier comes in and blows us away. Our Defense is part great and part shit. We have holes in two forward spots and one Dman and we have "Uncertainty" in the goalie position. How can we just assume we are going to be better?
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 9:35:28 AM
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htxt: esaki: Fair point. And I think that he might just like talking about the process. I get the sense that he feels like people don't understand how hard it is to build a team, and so he likes to go into detail when doing those interviews. Kinda like a parent going, "you won't like it, but here's why I'm doing this." And yes, it is condescending and (as you've argued) probably not the media-savvy. But I find it fascinating that he's willing to go on record and peel back the curtain that way.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 9:29:00 AM
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kingsforlife: Or maybe because he's really self-important.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 9:18:14 AM
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esaki: "So we're really talking about how the fans will react, and I think he doesn't really care what the fans think, because he believes he knows what's best." So that's fair htxt, except what the fans think does matter with respect to his reputation and -- if bad things happen this year -- his job security. If he doesn't care about what the fans think, why does he give so many interviews? He just likes chatting with Rich and Helene on the record?
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 9:10:39 AM
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htxt: esaki: I meant to say, "Agree that Lombardi should just follow...".
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 9:07:27 AM
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htxt: esaki: Lombardi should just follow Lou's example (well, except for the whole contract admission of guilt) and not comment on anything. But I don't know how much it would've helped, except that the fans would be less dissatisfied (and even that is arguable). I think that even if Lombardi didn't say a word about needing a defenseman and a couple of forwards, the 29 other GMs knew that info already. So did all the player agents for the UFAs this summer. So we're really talking about how the fans will react, and I think he doesn't really care what the fans think, because he believes he knows what's best.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 9:06:03 AM
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kingsforlife: lowdrive: Aside from Kovy, he could have put more emphasis on a top-four d-man. That does seem to be more important to DL than the top six winger slot.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 9:01:09 AM
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naturallawyer: htxt: IIRC, Hextall also said on the radio that they would look to improve the offense and to add a defenseman.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 8:55:35 AM
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naturallawyer: esaki: I actually agree on the press conference thing. Kovy has pretty much committed to NJ, so if the contract is voided NJ is sitting pretty in a negotiation. If there had been no press conference, the threat from the Kings is much bigger.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 8:53:42 AM
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esaki: No, I agree htxt, but he should've kept that posture up. He never should've said anything about getting a defenseman -- if we were truly runners-up for Paul Martin, he should've backchanneled that we weren't really interested. He could've been wishy-washy about the trade situation. He should have done exactly what Lamiorello did w/r/t Kovalchuk, at least up until the point of the press conference (which I still think was a great idea from the Devils' perspective). Ultimately, it's fun that Lombardi is so honest, it makes for good reading. But he simply cannot control the message, and because of that, he looks like a failure.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 8:51:28 AM
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naturallawyer: The quote I will remember most, from this whole summer, is where DL said that internal negotiations (with AEG) for Kovy were more difficult than the negotiations with Kovy's agent. That tells you the kind of commitment AEG has to winning.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 8:50:40 AM
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htxt: This was from the big pre-draft, pre-July 1 interview series by Hammond:
lakingsinsider.com
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 8:49:34 AM
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htxt: esaki: All fine points, but each time I actually go back and read what Lombardi said prior to July 1, he didn't appear to tip his hand in that manner. He said very little about getting a Dman, and whenever he was asked about UFAs he said, "well, trades are an option too." He wasn't even quoted on Kovalchuk until the whole thing was over.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 8:45:03 AM
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esaki: pnf, heh
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 8:34:31 AM
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naturallawyer: LD: there was lots of "I'm sure DL has a plan B", "let's see what he's got up his sleeve", etc. I think the general consensus here was "we're waiting to see plan B", not "I hope he has a plan B." DL is usually a charts and graphs guy, so even I find it surprising that DL was caught completely by surprise that they didn't get Kovy and he didn't have anything else lined up.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 8:33:54 AM
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esaki: Lombardi's problem -- his biggest flaw by a mile -- is that he talks too much, and he lacks any savviness with the media. He shouldn't have made it clear that he wanted a defenseman, knowing that the only two guys out there that fit the bill were Martin and Gonchar. He shouldn't have made it clear that he wanted Kovalchuk so badly, even though he knew he was cash-constrained and there was a strong likelihood he would be outbid. He should have recognized that there was a really good chance that he was going to be quiet this offseason, and then he should have controlled the message accordingly. Publicly: "We like our team. We need the money for extensions. Don't expect much from us this summer. Look at what's happening in Chicago. We don't want to be like them." Privately to Helene: "We don't think Kovalchuk is worth the money, and we don't want to build around him." Instead, he looks like a failure, and fans are pissed off at him. Again. And I don't really blame them, even though I don't really blame Lombardi for his inactions either.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 8:32:47 AM
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pucknfuss: wow, this site has become the 2010 version of the 70's "point counterpoint"..... Esaki you ignorant slut:)
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 8:31:39 AM
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lowdrive: Is there anything DL said that isn't exactly what we all said during this process? That he put all his eggs in the Kovalchuk basket even though he should have known he wasn't even close? But, as I said before, and as Esaki just said again, what else was there for him to do?
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 8:21:34 AM
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lowdrive: azking didn't "show up" to vent. He never left. That's the difference.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 8:20:32 AM
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esaki: My apologies, I meant to say "the shit we had last year except for six weeks in the middle of the season when Quick turned into Patrick Roy." I concede that, for a full month and a half, Quick was very good.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 8:11:49 AM
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esaki: Trade what? There's one guy who's moved in the trade market so far who's worth a damn, and most of you would have bitched if we had acquired him, even though he's awesome. There was one forward who was transformative who hit the market, Lombardi tried to get him, he ultimately was outbid, what's to be done? Look, I get the disappointment. It's a concrete fact that Lombardi has done nothing to significantly improve the team. But this whole "Oh, woe is us, we're now going to finish dead last in the league," even though our core's still improving and, one way or the other, we're going to have better goaltending that the shit we had last year.....please.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 8:10:57 AM
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pucknfuss: ummmm trade?
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 8:07:07 AM
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esaki: Lombardi's a bullshitter. Why get worked up? You really believe he couldn't do anything because he was focused on Kovalchuk for 19 days? Come on. There was nothing to be done.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 8:05:53 AM
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pucknfuss: kf98, why all the love for smyttie? He gave DL every opportunity to actually make a positive move this summer, and when that move was poni, he and az showed up to vent (rightfully so)
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 8:05:06 AM
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naturallawyer: This is the same DL that promised to address the offense in the off-season, right? He does know that he hasn't done that, right? Yeesh...
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 8:01:51 AM
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azking: This is a one and done playoff team as it stands right now even if they make it.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 7:59:55 AM
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naturallawyer: Since July 1, every time I've heard anything from TL or DL I've come away more concerned or depressed.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 7:59:17 AM
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azking: Dean just gave the fans a "Fuck you suckers" with that interview. Even the most die-hard pollyanna Dean Lombardi ass-licker has to admit his comments are a carbon copy of last year and that he sounds completely clueless. I mean, is it Dean's mission to look so stupid and incompentent when he answers these questions in a matter that yells "Gosh, we really weren't prepared for that" and then compounds it by saying they are essentially done except for a tweak or two? I'm so done with these candy ass comments.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 7:59:13 AM
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azking: We are a better team than when Dean got here. We were one of the worst teams in the NHL. That isn't a stretch. Dean however is a small pie guy. He can't think out of the box whatsoever. He can't multi-task, not creative and not aggressive. Those are the worst attributes you can have as a GM to go along with impulsive which makes Sather in NY a pile of shit now as well.
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 7:55:13 AM
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ericd: KF98 - I'm surprised... such a traveled person as you... and you havnent heard of good moaning... a piss take english comedy series catch phrase (esaki will probably recognise it... ) from Allo Allo...
www.youtube.com
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 2:02:42 AM
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ericd: Oh I get it now, the 40 point guy was the most important piece... not the solid or 2 way D so we can roll 3 pairs to firm that up and ensure if nothing else we are a bitch to play against...
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 1:42:28 AM
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ericd: bloody hell... other GM's keep signing other players while pursuing others... WTF? The deal was always a top 6 AND a top 4 D so tell me again why you couldnt go after the defenseman anyway reagardless of what was happening with Kovy? That interview screams to me anyway if DL can get a decent D on the cheap from a team that needs to shed cap space he will do it but quite frankly from that interview I dont see DL doing anything else viz this - "Lombardi said hes not done yet. Adding a defenseman to replace ODonnell and Jones is likely but the replacements could be determined by competition during training camp among the Kings defense prospects. If no one stands out, he might have to make a trade. Its safe to say that I am looking at one other thing Id like to try and do. However, our fall-back position is if we dont find what Im looking for I feel a lot better that we got at least the forward because I dont see an option on the forward, he said. Whether Ponikarovsky or Frolov, that was the first most important piece to me. I am looking at something but I dont feel the urgency I felt because of looking at our reserve list where, you say, Oh, that element isnt there. . Here we go... he's gonna hope like hell neck bruise or Voinov can step up and earn a roster spot or if not he is gonna make a last minute desperation signing of a Willie Mitchell (who knows he may do it sooner) or some other waiver wire or salary dump favor for somebody... Oh happy day...
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 1:38:52 AM
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kingsforlife: There are a lot of DL quotes in here NOT to like.
latimesblogs.latimes.com
Wednesday Jul 28, 2010 - 12:23:36 AM
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kingscast: NL: Agreed. The whole damned interview was unsettling. We had a huge opportunity to build on last year's success and didn't. I am really not that excited for the puck to drop.
Tuesday Jul 27, 2010 - 11:23:14 PM
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kingsforlife: It's sad that DL was unable to do anything else because he was so Kovy-focused, yet the Devils, the other team pursuing the same guy, and with FAR less cap space, was also able to focus on getting Volchenkov, Hedberg, and Tallinder.
Tuesday Jul 27, 2010 - 11:18:09 PM
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kingfan_98: historically, i think every time i've asked smyttie to put his money where his mouth is regarding the kings performance, he's either a) shut up and crawled away, or b) taken the action, and then when he was clearly losing, shut up and crawled away. so hey, at least he's consistent.
Tuesday Jul 27, 2010 - 11:05:06 PM
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naturallawyer: That quote is quite unsettling.
Tuesday Jul 27, 2010 - 11:03:53 PM
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kingfan_98: nice. smyttie comes out of the woodwork long enough to vomit all over the rt, only to disappear soon a la the playoffs. but don't worry, the first three game losing streak, he'll be back bitching and moaning. i can barely wait.
Tuesday Jul 27, 2010 - 11:02:44 PM
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naturallawyer: So much time and energy went into this Kovalchuk thing that youre exposed. Because it dragged on for so long and arguably has continued to drag on, we werent addressing other needs. It was impossible anyway, Lombardi said. And then you get into the problem that we are in a free-agency mode and everything is tied to this guy that youre clearly telling the marketplace that everybody else is second fiddle.
Tuesday Jul 27, 2010 - 11:02:43 PM
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lowdrive: well, its closer to status quo anyway.
Tuesday Jul 27, 2010 - 10:58:53 PM
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kingsforlife: DL seems way too geeked to get Poni. Signing Poni sure as hell isn't a "recovery" by any stretch of the imagination IMO.
Tuesday Jul 27, 2010 - 10:56:26 PM
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lowdrive: fascinating quote from Dean confirming they were doing nothing while focusing on Kovalchuk. Really? I thought they were!
latimesblogs.latimes.com
Tuesday Jul 27, 2010 - 10:16:30 PM
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Scribe: lowdrive: LOL
Tuesday Jul 27, 2010 - 10:06:22 PM
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lowdrive: I had to re-read this like 5 times.." I don't think Lombardi needs to be fired at all. We are way better as a team than when he got here." - Azking
Tuesday Jul 27, 2010 - 10:03:06 PM
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ericd: almost home. Back later...
Tuesday Jul 27, 2010 - 9:23:43 PM
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ericd: when does the arbiters ruling come due? Friday?
Tuesday Jul 27, 2010 - 9:22:13 PM
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ericd: az - its frustration in wanting the kings to make positive moves to get better
Tuesday Jul 27, 2010 - 9:20:48 PM
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ericd: if poni is it this summer is an epic fail. Lets caveat that by saying if we just get more trash its still an epic fail
Tuesday Jul 27, 2010 - 9:18:26 PM
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azking: Off the topic, I do appreciate the board here because it does allow us to vent and it also allows us to get different views. I really do respect the views of all here and while we may not agree, it is nice to be able to just shoot the shit and hear what others think. We all ultimately want the same thing and while some of us are more impatient than others, we all deserve the forum to explain why we feel a certain way and also deserve the acknowledgement and respect from others regardless of whether they side with our side or another side. I think we lose sight of this sometimes and we have been really chippy the last few months.
Tuesday Jul 27, 2010 - 9:09:02 PM
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azking: I just can't get behind this team right now until they show that they will backup their claims that they are ready to make the moves and spend the money to take it up a notch. Until they do that, they deserve every bit of shit thrown their way because they look like liars right now. I give no credit for trying to do shit. That gets you nowhere. Nobody remembers who came in second. You have to win one of these things eventually. It is embarrassing and Lombardi should be embarrassed to keep being made to look like the head of some second class organization.
Tuesday Jul 27, 2010 - 9:04:17 PM
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